Tuesday, October 5, 2010

Bring Back Sports Arguments

Leo: "Sorry to tell you this but King threw out the monologue."

Alice: "Leo, that monologue was good."

Sy Benson: “Check that. Perfect. I wrote it! This is where Sy Benson draws the line. ... First came the word and the word was funny. The monologue stays or I go."

Benjy: "Sy, maybe we can compromise."

Sy: "No compromise! Sy Benson has his integrity, his pride. King does that monologue word for word or I walk. I walk!"

Seconds later:

Sy: "King! About the monologue!"

King Kaiser: "Wait a minute! Sy! Do you smell something? (Sniff) It's coming from the script. ... (Holds script up to nose and sniffs) Ew, it's your monologue. Ugh, what a stinkburger. ... KC, pull!"

(His assistant KC throws the crumpled-up script in the air. King shoots it down. "BOOM!" Sy clutches his heart.)

King: "I hate it. It's not funny. It's out."

Sy: "Hey, babe, we're not married to it."

-- From "My Favorite Year."

* * *

It seems to me that few people enjoy confrontation. Oh there are some who love it, thrive on it, make a nice living by sparking confrontation. But I certainly don't. I was on a plane not too long ago -- yes, this will be the story about me getting yelled at on a plane, though the concept sounds better than it is -- and it was an early morning flight. I ended up sitting one row behind my actual seat by mistake. The guy who was sitting in my seat said, "Um, I think I'm in 14A" (or whatever it was) and I was thoroughly embarrassed and said, "Oh, I'm sorry." And I moved up one row. This wasn't the yelling part.

About three minutes later, a flight attendant came back to tell me that I had been upgraded to first class ... a perk that comes with flying a lot. Well, I thanked her and moved up to first class. And I was sitting there when all of a sudden a man walked up to first class -- not the man whose seat I had mistakenly taken but a different man, an Army man, dressed in full camouflage -- and he tapped me on the shoulder and said, "Excuse me, there's something I wanted to tell you."

I turned around. And the guy screamed, "I just wanted to tell you that you are a selfish human being. You are an extremely selfish person. I would not have forgiven myself if I didn't tell you that before you got off the plane. You are a very, very selfish person."

And then, before I could say a word, he walked back to his seat.

Well ... now what? The flight attendant came over to ask what that was all about, and I had to tell her that I had absolutely no idea. And I didn't. And just about then, the plane took off, and I had to sit there and try to figure out what I was supposed to do. At first I thought maybe I should go back and ask the guy what that was all about, confront him there, but I decided against it. I didn't want to create some sort of scene on the plane. I had no idea why the guy was yelling at me. Maybe I had hit him in the head with my backpack without realizing it or apologizing. Maybe he had tried to talk to me and I had ignored him. Maybe he was a big Yuni Betancourt fan. I didn't know. I went over about 500 possibilities in my head because this is the ridiculous kind of person I am. And I hate confrontation.

I knew in the end the right way for me to handle it was to get off the plane, wait for him to come out, and directly confront him. I didn't WANT to do this, not at all. But I had to do it. I have friends, many of them, who would have instinctively handled this in a better way. But you have to play your own cards. And so, for the rest of the flight I thought about what I must have done and dreaded the landing.

There's no exciting finish to this non-exciting story. I waited for him to get off the plane, he tried to ignore me at first, and then I said: "Excuse me but what was that all about?" It turned out to be some ridiculous misunderstanding ... he thought I was trying to steal that guy's seat and then had tricked my way up to first class, or something like that. I never fully understood. Whatever the case was, I told him that none of that was true, and that I may be a lot of things but I don't think selfish really applies. After we talked for a while, he thanked me for straightening it out and we went on our ways. Like I said: The story isn't as good as the headline.

In any case, I dislike confrontation. I would go out of my way to avoid it. I think a lot of people feel the same way. I put the classic bit from My Favorite Year (one of my all-time favorite movies) on top because, well, Sy could be me. Maybe Sy could be you too ... I don't know you.

And I think confrontation has taken on big role in sports -- not in PLAYING sports (where confrontation has always been a big part of the action) but in watching sports, in analyzing sports, in talking about sports, in THINKING about sports. Take the postseason baseball awards. I noticed Monday that one of my e-migos, Will Carroll, was taking a beating on Twitter because he said that if he had an American League Cy Young vote (he does not) he would vote for C.C. Sabathia. And I noticed that on the same day, my co-worker and friend Tom Verducci put out his awards choices, and said he thinks Felix Hernandez will win, not only because people have a better feel for how little pitcher wins really mean but also because of "how fast and wide groupthink travels these days."

I actually DO have an American League Cy Young vote and out-of-respect for the process I will not reveal my vote ... though if you are a regular reader here, I suspect you already know my vote. I have not exactly hidden my feelings on the subject. My point here is that it seems there is a black-and-white, up-and-down, Democrat-and-Republican, yes-and-no, right-and-wrong feel to baseball arguments these days. And it seems to me that sports used to BE like that ... and I really don't want to go back to those days.

I remember thinking about this hard in 2008 when Alex Rodriguez easily won the MVP award. I thought A-Rod deserved the MVP Award; in my mind, he was pretty clearly the best player in the league that year. But you might recall that year that Detroit outfielder Magglio Ordonez got two first place votes, the only two A-Rod did not get, and both from Detroit writers. Well, there was quite a bit of screaming about it, about the Detroit guys being homers, about A-Rod being jobbed from a unanimous MVP choice and all that. But more to the point, there was quite a bit of screaming about how the Detroit writers WERE WRONG ... like A-Rod was the ONLY viable MVP choice.

I thought Bill James hit the subject hard and well in the 2008 Gold Mine: "I see absolutely nothing wrong or remarkable in the two MVP votes for Magglio Ordonez ... Yes, A-Rod had a fantastic season, but Ordonez' season is ... well, Al Kaline was the same kind of hitter, and Kaline never came close to those numbers: 139 RBI, .363 average, 54 doubles, 28 homers. It was well above the standard of your average MVP season.

"Yes, A-Rod created more runs than Ordonez, but not that many more (159-146). Since when did a 13-run separation in offensive performance become a prohibitive barrier to sportswriters taking a broader view of the issue?"

A broader view of the issue. Exactly. I feel sure I would have voted for A-Rod ... in fact, I might have voted for A-Rod, I don't remember if I had a vote that year. But these things in sports are not crystal clear, aren't without ambiguity, aren't without nooks and crannies and subtleties and difference of opinion. There was a viable argument to be made for Ordonez (A-Rod's one offensive advantage -- and it was a big one -- was in home runs. But Ordonez led A-Rod in some other stuff -- including on-base percentage, doubles and RBI minus homers (they scored the same number of runs minus homers). And whether I AGREE or not with Magglio for MVP argument, I would very much like to HEAR the argument. I wouldn't want that argument shouted down before it was ever made.

But I think that's where we are going again. I do think we are getting back to the point in sports where arguments are being shouted down before they are made, that in this stats vs. scouts world of baseball that people are simply not even listening to the other side, that baseball is being turned into a game show like Do You Want To Be A Millionaire, where only one answer can be accepted as correct.

And it bugs me. Let me take this in a different direction for one second: You know why I love baseball statistics? Because they help me look at the game in a way I never had before. That's all. I don't love NUMBERS (though, I've always had a crush on the number 573 -- but who hasn't?), I love the way those numbers can spark in the imagination. It is true that for years and years in baseball we were hammered with the same empty platitudes -- pitching is 75% of baseball, some hitters are better in the clutch than they are the rest of the time, a great shortstop can save you 100 runs a year with his defense, players are in their primes from 27 to 32 or so, you don't want a guy in the middle of your lineup who walks a lot, bases are stolen off the pitcher, the best fielders were the ones who made the fewest errors, the most important thing is to have players on your team who are gamers ... and so on. For a long time, you were told to believe those things, and disagreeing meant confrontation. Few people like confrontation. And so we kept getting fed the same baseball meals.

But you know what? Bill James liked confrontation. He and a few others started testing some of those platitudes by the numbers, by logic, and they began to suspect that some of these platitudes ... most of these platitudes ... really about all these platitudes were overstated at best, pure nonsense at worst. How could baseball really be 75% pitching? We were supposed to stuff hitting and fielding into the remaining 25%?

And by studying that pitching is 75% of baseball thing (and mocking it, yes), people came up with some pretty fascinating and new thoughts about pitching, some of them cutting hard against what the mind had been led to believe.

Wait a minute, Bill and others said: Pitchers don't win games, not by themselves. We know that ... why do we keep denying that point?

Wait a minute, Bill and others said: You can't judge a pitcher without considering the ballpark where he pitches.

Wait a minute, Bill and others said: Strikeout generally pitchers DO NOT burn out faster than finesse pitchers ... quite the opposite.

Bill and others weren't always right. But the point wasn't being right. The point was making the argument, questioning everything, refusing to accept something because it SEEMED so. One of the most fascinating baseball topics of the last few years has built around this question: How much control does a pitcher have over hits allowed? It's easy to tell from the stats that some pitchers strike out more batters than others, some pitchers walk fewer batters than others, some pitchers give up fewer home runs than others. These are repeatable skills.

But how much control does a pitcher have if the plate appearance is not a strikeout, walk or homer.

Well here are some assorted pitchers' career batting average on balls hit in play:

Andy Messersmith: .243

Mike Norris: .249

Jim Palmer: .251

Mario Soto: .257

Sandy Koufax: .259

Mariano Rivera: .263

Larry Gura: .265

Bud Black: .266

Eric Show: .267

Steve McCatty: .268

Nolan Ryan: .269

Orlando Hernandez: .270

Woody Williams: .280

Tim Belcher: .283

Mark Portugal: .283

Eric Milton: .285

Greg Maddux: .286

Steve Trachsel: .288

Kirk Rueter: .289

Brett Tomko: .291

Randy Johnson: .295

Tim Lincecum: .301

Zack Greinke: .310

Even now, I have a hard time believing a pitcher has NO control (beyond Ks, walks and HRs) over a hitters' ability to get hits -- I know instinctively that batting-practice fastballs will yield more singles than Tim Lincecum sliders -- but the stats have certainly convinced me that a pitcher has FAR LESS CONTROL over hits than I ever would have suspected on my own. I mean Brett Tomko has a lower career BABIP than Lincecum. Mark Portugal has a much better BABIP than Randy Johnson. That's what baseball stats can do for me as a fan ... they can expand my scope, give me new things to think about, pull back curtains, create beautiful arguments.

And I worry that we are beginning to lose those arguments again -- ironically, at least in part, BECAUSE of the proliferation of baseball stats. I cannot tell you how many people have sent me emails quoting one of my favorite statistics, Wins Above Replacement, as if that's an argument ender. No! To me WAR is an argument STARTER. That's what's beautiful about it. The fact that (according to Baseball Reference) Felix Hernandez has a 6.0 WAR and C.C. Sabathia has a 5.4 WAR doesn't end the Cy Young debate for me. It starts it.

As it turns out, while I hate confrontation in my personal life, I don't mind it when it comes to baseball. I don't mind people thinking I'm an idiot ... I think that about myself anyway. But I do think there are some people out there (and I cannot blame them) who would rather just conform to stuff they don't think or believe rather than get blitzed on the Internet or barraged on Twitter. I do worry about what Tom calls group think.

Yes, absolutely, I do believe that if Felix Hernandez wins the Cy Young, it will be a breakthrough -- even more than Greinke or Lincecum last year -- and proof that the voters didn't just fall back on wins the way they often did in the past.

But I really hope anyone who believed C.C. Sabathia had the better year voted for him and will make the argument for him. Sabathia had one hell of a season. He pitched for a Yankees team that, for much of the season, did not have a viable second starter. New York won 23 of the 34 starts he made. He pitched under some intense pennant pressure. There's an argument to be made. I've always thought that was one of the best things about sports. There's always an argument to be made.

44 comments:

  1. Circle me Abbott & Costello

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  2. If only they gave votes to the Fire Joe Morgan guys.

    http://deadspin.com/5644786/reports-of-murray-chasss-sanity-have-been-greatly-exaggerated

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  3. I'm sorry but it's backhanded comments like that one from Verducci that keeps me from giving hits to si.com, I'd rather just come to joeblog.

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  4. agree that rather than berating people for their conclusions, we should ask them for their reasoning. in fact, that is what some did on twitter yesterday with carroll. he replied that a deciding factor for him was player interviews, and who other players thought were more dominant.

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  5. Really, Tom? People just deciding that 20 wins = Cy Young isn't an example of groupthink? Give me a break.

    Also, it has to be said: that guy on the airplane was a real jerk. Honestly, who does that? You're not Robin Hood, guy. Sit down.

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  6. Joe, were you a big Harmon Killebrew fan? Because the second you said 573 I knew that someone ended with that many home runs.

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  7. It is the beauty and the curse of technology. On the bright side, we get the opportunity to communicate with people from all over the place. It I was stuck with my immediate circle of friends, I would rarely get a chance to think about and talk baseball outside of one buddy who loves the Mets a little too much.

    On the downside, we can rocket out a reaction through Twitter before the thought has even been completed. It is a shouting match instead of an intelligent discussion.

    Technology is only going to make things even more immediate so I am not sure how to get to Joe's utopia outside of turning off our phones and going to the pub to watch the games and debate over a few pops.

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  8. Bill Simmons has made the point(http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100402) that sabermetrics has lessened what was always a fun aspect of baseball: arguing the relative merits of players past and present. What's the fun of musing about whether, say, Chase Utley is better than Ryne Sandberg was when we now have statistics that seem to resolve the answers definitively?

    I'm on board with the sabermetric train but the moral certainty of some writers is irritating. Are we really so sure that our current metrics are accurate? Are we going to look back in 10 years and mock WAR or Win Shares much as we mock the RBI/pitcher win/batting average analyses that dominated for decades?

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  9. I didn't care for Tom Verducci's flippant comment either. Higher WAR = Cy Young or MVP is no more groupthink than 20 wins = Cy Young or 500 HRs = Hall of Fame.

    I think Joe's right on this one, as usual. We've reached a point with stats where we've stopped thinking critically. This is not to say that WAR isn't a better way to guage a pitcher's performance than wins, because I'm pretty sure it is. But that doesn't mean WAR is the end of the argument.

    I've gotta say, though, that it really warms the cackles of my heart to see at least some people have moved beyond wins as an automatic qualifier for the Cy Young. Go check out Randy Johnson's 2004 season for an amazing season being robbed of a Cy Young, or the year Johan Santana lost it to Bartolo Colon. In just 6 short years, we've come a long way.

    In Glengarry Glen Ross, it's Always Be Closing. In sports, as in life, it should be Always Be Questioning. As soon as everyone starts thinking the same, everyone stops thinking. Prior to the NFL season, everyone was picking the Green Bay Packers to be the NFC champion. I mean, everybody was picking them. Well guess what? They lost to Chicago a week ago, and pulled out a 2-point win over Detroit at home this week. Everyone was picking Green Bay, and as a result nobody was actually thinking about it.

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  10. Regarding the BABIP list, it appears that those with lower BABIPs pitched in low-offense eras (excepting Rivera).

    For example, the league-wide BABIP for Koufax's career was .276, while for Lincecum it has been .300.

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  11. whoa whoa whoa --

    "After we talked for a while, he thanked me for straightening it out and we went on our ways. "

    he 'thanked' you?

    No, that's just not how it works.
    I hope there were apologies he sent your way - and I hope he learned a lesson that day.

    He made a scene, and made a fool out of you. (Though I'm sure he didn't look good either). Also, you sat with that the entire flight - what a burden!

    I'm still reading the rest of the post but I thought that warrented mentioning.

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  12. The A-Rod MVP vote was in 2007 not 2008. Dustin Pedroia won in 2008.

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  13. I tell this to my stats class too... even though numbers have the aura of certainty (I mean, look, they have decimals and everything... how exact is that?) that statistics is a highly imperfect field. Our jobs as statisticians is more about reducing known error than producing rock-hard certainty. There is always room for doubt.

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  14. producer Leo Silver: Where are you going?

    King Kaiser: With you to meet Boss Rojack.

    Leo: Stan, what's the matter with you? Do you think Boss Rojack is here because he likes the Boss Hijack sketch? You think he likes getting made fun of in front of 40 million people every Sunday night?

    King: I don't know. Let's find out!

    One of the funniest, most under-rated comedies every.

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  15. There's no bigger fan of this blog than me but come on. NOBODY did more than Joe to advance the position that there were no acceptable choices for AL MVP and Cy last year other than Mauer and Greinke. To come back a year later with this, hey, disagreement is part of the fun! stuff is disingenuous.

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  16. Gee, it's hard to believe that a member of the United States military might misread the facts, insert himself into a situation where he has no business, and fuck it up royally.

    Did you remember to thank him for his service after he reamed you?

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  17. I didn't read the context of the group think comment, but I do think there is some group think. Or momentum. I read somewhere that the writer believed Doc will get the Cy Young unanimously. I'm a Phillies fan and he has had a spectacular season (and I hope he wins), but in a year with so many great candidates I find that hard to believe.

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  18. Hard to take WAR seriously when no one can agree how to count it. Sneer at wins if you want but at least we know how many Sabathia has. (Hernandez is a no-brainer, though.)

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  19. When I saw 573, I didn't think of Harmon Killebrew. I thought of Mike Bossy - 573 goals.

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  20. Joe, I admit that your blog has made me look at more stats than I ever did in the past. However, you will NEVER get me to consider WAR a credible stat for one simple reason. How is it that CC is only 1/2 a win lower than Felix when every other stat is considerably in Felix's favor except wins and "pressure starts"? It seems a serious quandry that CC is only a half a win less than Felix, yet he is a run worse in ERA, almost .140 worse in WHIP, 35 less strikeouts in only 12 less innings, has an ERA+ of 40 points less, has almost 2 less Adj. Pitching Wins, and has a wpa of 2 full point less. Aren't those all "sabremetrician" numbers? Isn't WAR supposed to kinda take all of that into account and then come up with a # of "Wins Above Replacement"?

    Seems a little out of whack for a hybrid "old school turning stat geek" like myself...

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  21. Beautiful article, Joe. Thanks.

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  22. Great job Joe (as usual). The stats (whether basic or SABRmetric) need to be argument starters, not enders. Bring back the arguments!

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  23. Because I have a short man's complex I never outgrew, I do not shy away from confrontation. However, my zeal for faceoffs has been tempered by three decades of marriage.
    What I've learned to do is try to avoid the mistakes like the man who yelled at Joe on the plane.
    That is to say, I stopped making assumptions. Once I did that, both the frequency of my confronations and my desire to engage in confrontational behavior diminished by 90 percent. After 50 years, maybe I have outgrown that short man's complex.
    Another grat post, Joe.

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  24. Regarding the notion of sports arguments more broadly: I taught a senior Communications course at Miami University called "Sports Arguments." It was basically a typical argumentation course except I used sports topics for all the examples.

    It was very popular among both male and female students. There was also unusually high demand from my colleagues to do guest lectures. The Athletic Director at Miami came to class one day to discuss the merits of Title IX, for example.

    It's really stunning how much easier it is to convey basic argumentation theory (i.e. source credibility, use of evidence, statistical manipulation) to college students by using the context of sports.

    We also debated questions ranging from the mundane "Who is the greatest NFL QB of all time?" to issues that involved more complex social theories in areas of race, gender, economics etc.

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  25. Great post. I know it can be tiresome to listen to some baseball fans belittle statistics, but I hope people can realize they are just as closed-minded by insisting that stats are conclusive and that anything that "can't be measured" is meaningless or at least can't be argued.

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  26. "However, you will NEVER get me to consider WAR a credible stat for one simple reason. How is it that CC is only 1/2 a win lower than Felix when every other stat is considerably in Felix's favor ...?"

    I don't have the WAR formulas in front of me or anything, and in fact I don't know what they look like. But half a win isn't really that small an amount considering that the difference between a replacement player and an MVP is only 8 or so. Also, WAR takes into account defense, and Baseball Reference lists Hernandez at +8 Rdef (the number of runs of support he got from his defense) while Sabathia is at -1. Therefore Hernandez's gaudier stats do have to take into account that he pitched in front of a better defense. He still pitched better, but give Sabathia the M's defense and it might not have been such a walk, hence why the WAR number is closer than you might expect.

    Here's something I did find funny when I was researching this - B-R lists Sabathia's average leverage index (an attempt to objectively judge the amount of pressure faced by a pitcher in an average game) as .9, and Felix's as 1.0. So much for the people who want to claim that Sabathia's season was clearly more impressive because he pitched in more "big spots."

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  27. Joe, what's your feeling concerning your fellow writers about open and honest debate? Are you able to fully engage colleagues like Tom Verducci or Jon Heyman on the various statistical discussions and topics?

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  28. Circle me, Steven Slater.

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  29. Another minor quibble... I thought that one of the Magglio first-place votes had come from a writer based in Seattle. Perhaps I misremember.

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  30. I think that the divide comes from the desire to have an answer --a complete answer-- right now. I always had the impression that Bill James saw sabermetrics as a means to an end, a way to look at baseball differently and see what works and what does not. It wasn't meant to replace conventional baseball theories as much as it was meant to test them and perhaps even expand them (and yes, if necessary, discredit some of them).

    But that requires a learning process, and those can take time and they don't always provide answers right away, and sometimes they provide the wrong answers. People want the right answer NOW. I think that too many people take the incomplete (and in parts, incorrect) knowledge we've gained from sabermetrics and put it forth as the complete answer. And on the other side, you have people who take offense to this and enter the fray convinced that it is all wrong. It's a recipe for the kind of convoluted debate (that cannot possibly go anywhere productive) that we see so often online.

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  31. I have to disagree with the CC pitched in the heat of a pennant race argument. Did he really? For how long did we KNOW that the Yankees and Rays were both going to the playoffs? Since the All-Star break? Earlier? The purely aesthetic division winner vs wild card distinction does not a heated pennant race make.

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  32. I still can't get past the idea that Joe could be friends with a philandering scumbag like Will Carroll. Wow.

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  33. Groupthink is an unfortunate use of words by Verducci. Groupthink means people are thinking the same thing without using evidence to back up their beliefs. Nothing could be further from the truth with Felix vs. CC. People like you, Joe, and others have educated people about how much better Felix is than CC. Others have looked at the numbers and have by themselves come to the conclusion that Felix was better than CC this year. It's based on evidence. I hardly think the majority of people who will vote for Felix are just going along with the crowd.

    If anything, saying Felix with 13 wins is better than CC with 21 wins has forced people to look more closely at the numbers.

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  34. I LOVE this post.


    CC has an argument, but a really weak one :)

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  35. I'm with the anonymous poster above (they're no longer numbered on the new blog?). The fact that Camouflage Man went out of his way to follow you up to first class and attack you verbally with only the vaguest grasp of the facts seems like a metaphor for American foreign policy. I don't think I would have had the nerve to wait after the flight and set the guy straight like Joe did. I'd like to think the soldier learned a little humility, but probably not, if history is any indication.

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  36. @JC #2 --

    Thanks for that. I had no idea the FJM guys were writing anything (baseball-related) any more. I read every one of their posts at Deadspin with enormous enjoyment, and a tinge of sadness that the FJM blog is no more.

    OTOH, I was also reminded why I completely ignore Deadspin (which is why I thank you for the link). Aside from the fact that the writing is not generally all that good or interesting, their commenters would not collectively equal one BR from Joe's blog.

    Best example: in the comments to the post mocking Jim Caple's obsession with RUNS as the be-all and end-all of BB stats, at least 4 commenters were confused by the distinction between runs and RBI (no, seriously), each asking some variation of "Doesn't the team with the most RBI always have the most runs?"

    Wonder who they think gets the RBI when a run scores on a wild pitch or passed ball?

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  37. @Mark Daniel --

    Good point. I wonder if Verducci considers it an example of "groupthink" that most people think that 2+2=4?

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  38. Carlton '80
    Gooden '85
    Scott '86
    Saberhagen '89
    Maddux '92
    Randy '02
    King Felix '10

    These are the seven most recent pitcher seasons with 30 Quality Starts. The first six guys on the list all won the Cy Young Award.

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  39. A thought... I used to be (retired now, kinda) a statistical analyst, and something in the Historical Abstract always struck me. In a nutshell, an analyst's job is not to quantify what is seen, but to uncover what has thusfar been unseen.

    Lies, damn lies, and statistics - I completely agree that they are a conversation starter, and, when you are talking "most valuable" or "best", like any logical argument the answer is dependent on your premises. I don't agree with this assessment of "most valuable", but, if you assume "best player" or "most productive player" "on a playoff team", then RBIs are certainly arguable as the best measure, maybe even having to be from the Rays or the Phillies. Or, using other measures, one can make an at least pseudo-plausible case for any of ten players from either league as MVP.

    The point is that we are taking data points, ratios, all kinds of things, and internally assigning them value and thus giving, individually, certain stats "credibility". That doesn't make them wrong or right, it only provides fodder for a personal opinion, and "awards" happen to be a compilation of personal opinions.

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  40. "Are we going to look back in 10 years and mock WAR or Win Shares much as we mock the RBI/pitcher win/batting average analyses that dominated for decades?"

    That's a sort of Foxnews line of argument, no? Arguing with silly hypotheticals? RBIs and Pitcher wins are mocked because they're ridiculously simplistic and rely too much on teammate contributions to be accurate for judging individuals. That's always been the case, it just hasn't been talked about until recently. Stats aren't like new technologies, constantly phasing each other out as they grow more advanced. While WAR and the like aren't perfect, if we can't find anything utterly silly in them now, we never will.

    And I've always hated that Simmons argument. It's akin to lamenting about the ease of finding something to watch back in the days when there were only six channels. Yeah, you lose a tad bit of nostalgia. But stats open up so many doors for discussion that weren't there before.

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  41. Joe, I think you did a great thing by talking with the plane-shouter.

    First, the sympathy. Who knows what demons are running around in an angry person's head, whether he's in uniform or not? He clearly didn't understand the situation, but from his perspective he was doing the right thing.

    By talking with him, you may have obliterated his mental stereotype and reintroduced him to the experience of give-and-take with a real person.

    Finally, the hope. That if, carrying weapons, he goes into an unfamiliar foreign village, he will check out his assumptions before pulling a trigger.

    If we're sending guys into places where, in order to survive, they have to shoot first and ask questions later, our wars of choice are definitely the wrong choice.

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  42. I don't think Tom Verducci meant to slam anyone with the "groupthink" comment. I think he was commenting on how quickly the sentiment that Hernandez deserves to win (which he does) spread when, just two years ago, his winning would be unthinkable. The sports media is prone to spreading ideas because are trendy, even if, in cases like this, the idea is probably correct. Verducci just used a poor choice of words.

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  43. I am just fine with arguments.

    As for the poll, I think "American Pie" deserves consideration for best American recording, as does "Born in the USA" and Simon and Garfunkel's "America" and even "As Time Goes By".

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